ı talk about ex Gs player gordon jamon lucas gordonOriginally Posted by surfer
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me too, there's no official signing yet. If they keep Kinsey, Gordon won't be signed.ı talk about ex Gs player gordon jamon lucas gordon
la piscine, j'adore la piscine! towels, sunscreens, bathing suits. diving boards and towels. those ladders, towels.
unlike zagreb and cibona they have big company behind them. they didn't pay half milion euros to coach to play with buch of medicore players. they plan to spend 5-7 milion euros on team wich is highest evrer buget in history of any basketball team from ex yugoslavia. if they do scouting good they for sure won't be like cibona and zagreb las two years
Romeo Travis about Zadar coach Ante NazorRomeo Travis @RomeTrav
I said coach why we practice so much. He said God will bless us after all this hard work. How can I argue with that !
I don't really think that we will miss Glyniadakis, Papadopoulos, Pelekanos, and Vasilopoulos that much.
Thanks for the heads-up
Seriously, EuroLeague median level degrades with the more non-elite teams participating. No Pamesa, no Bilbao, no Cantu, no UNICS (one of the last two may qualify from the additional tournament but still...), no Spartak SPb... I mean, if we exchange Eastern European eternal losers like Prokom, Cedevita and some Lithuanian, ex-Yugo and Turkish teams (the last ones no matter how high are their budgets consistently suck with the pleasant exception of last season's Galatasaray) with the solid Spanish, Italian and Russian ones the whole thing would become much more competitive. As of today only some 10-12 of the current EL teams would have their places among the best 24 teams based on their strength. Turkey with three teams (more than Italy and Russia), Lithuania and Germany with two... well, it seems that real tournament will start with the beginning of Top 16. Group A is the most interesting but we need to see how will Fenerbahce round up their roster and how many players would run out from Athens.
Which Italian teams? The only decent teams in Italy are Siena, Milano, and Cantu, and probably all three of them will be in the Euroleague. So what exact other Italian teams do you think should be in the Euroleague? I absolutely cannot see that there are any.
man, if u are so sure.... the best thing you can do is: to bet all your money for olympiakos first in the group. is very easy money for you, impossible to lose. so, you could do a favor to your friends or family, say them that you know how to win easy money.... with the greek crisis is a a great favor to know the future. in my country (spain) we are also in crisis, and trust me, if I know the future, if I know something sure, I would do that, bet all my money in bet365 or similar.
and now talking more seriously. the rosters are incomplete, I think that olympiakos could be first, second, third, fourth..... anything is possible. olympiakos last year had a lot of problems in the first phase and also in the top16. olympiakos won the last euroleague, was great, was miraculous, but is difficult to repeat another miracle..... and now people like you think that your are the best team in the world, and sincerely you are not.
in a way i agree with you -,EuroLeague median level degrades with the more non-elite teams participating
but on a closer look this is clearly oxymoron.
It is like saying that New Jersey degrades NBA.Or some other bottom NBA team.NO,it doesn't .
NO matter how you fiddle,it is all down to logic.If you have all teams in Euroleague with a budget of 50 mil each,there would still be mediocre and bad,and one super bad team..
And there still would be one winner.
What you call mediocre teams brings so much in - attendance(Zalgiris is top with nearly 15000 per game),coverage and popularity.
Not all of them.
But then again - you would have 10 Spanish teams competing vs 10 Russian and 4 Turkish just according to the budget.Who the f would care?
I think it was idea of Darwin that diversity is good for progress.
probably not,but hey,i am too drunk to know anyway
you can add khimki here...team known for wasting money, no fans at all and best achivment top 16Eastern European eternal losers like Prokom, Cedevita and some Lithuanian, ex-Yugo and Turkish teams
Romeo Travis about Zadar coach Ante NazorRomeo Travis @RomeTrav
I said coach why we practice so much. He said God will bless us after all this hard work. How can I argue with that !
i dont think Euroleague should be running after the teams, which have money, but dont have any fan base or be a closed league with some spanish/russian teams. not to mention the spirit of european basketball itself, just compare the crowds in turkey, croatia, lithuania and lets say russia.
Known Zalgiris haters: madmax, Terrorizer
very disappointing draw, I wanted to see MTA and PANA face each other again. Guess I'll have to keep my fingers crossed for the top 16 draw.
We signed Nathan jaway as 3th center. Tuesday 100% official, we're still fixing our gym for his weight
http://www.ara.cat/esports/basquet/N...737326382.html
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First of all oly in the first phase of last year's euroleague was a different team to the team that ended the season. Not only were 2 extremely valuable Americans added (law, dorsey ) , but we had injury problems at the beginning . Secondly there was nothing "miraculous" about what oly did, the team became extremely strong at the middle of the season and it was obvious that they could go far . Many people are stuck on the final match of EL but before that oly crashed teams of the caliber of Barcelona and Siena , and after the EL final defeated the extremely strong pao in a best of 5 series .man, if u are so sure.... the best thing you can do is: to bet all your money for olympiakos first in the group. is very easy money for you, impossible to lose. so, you could do a favor to your friends or family, say them that you know how to win easy money.... with the greek crisis is a a great favor to know the future. in my country (spain) we are also in crisis, and trust me, if I know the future, if I know something sure, I would do that, bet all my money in bet365 or similar.
and now talking more seriously. the rosters are incomplete, I think that olympiakos could be first, second, third, fourth..... anything is possible. olympiakos last year had a lot of problems in the first phase and also in the top16. olympiakos won the last euroleague, was great, was miraculous, but is difficult to repeat another miracle..... and now people like you think that your are the best team in the world, and sincerely you are not.
All the valuable oly players stayed except for Dorsey and he might return too and they will be 1 year older and more experienced plus they will sign an American SF that wil probably give more to the team than Kesely . The only problem Oly has to face is the absence of Ivkovic but other than that the team is more than ready to defend its title and be strong from the beginning of EL this time .
pohani, I know you're teasing me but I'll make a serious answer
While in EuroLeague we managed to have 3,500-4,000 people attendance. Not something great but not that atrocious. pohani, you don't know a shit about Khimki fans and believe me there are many of them here. Khimki is one of the basketball centers of Russia despite its short history. Remember that Khimki isn't a big city: it has only some 200,000 population and many of them aren't natives of our city and hence aren't that interested in the local matters. Still many Khimchane are very interested in basketball. We have a lovely arena, fans who know their game but aren't that fanatical or loud as their Lithuanian/Southern European counterparts and a great tradition in basketball including raising the players for our NT: both Fridzon and Mozgov revealed themselves while playing in Khimki and they are key players for Russia NT. So stop talking shit about Khimki, you know Croatian club basketball last years was atrocious results- and game-wise but I'm not talking shit about teams from your country.
I don't propose a closed league format - in fact I'm definitely against it. I just want to see more just and flexible system with the best teams roster- and game-wise playing in EuroLeague. Without behind the doors decisions, without wild cards, without corrupt Licenses A and their venal redistribution like with last year's Milano, without senseless twaddle about stability instead of competitiveness. Ranking system modeled on UEFA example could do wonders with the EL (and EC also) level and toughness of competition. And it would immediately pay off because profits including translations rights would massively increase.
Why such a talented teams like Pamesa or Khimki are mostly playing in EuroCup while teams like Prokom and Zalgiris are A-licenses holders and constantly playing in EL despite being really mediocre? Is it a just thing?
ok, let's talk crowds in Lithuania, Croatia and Turkey. Last season Rudupis was playing in EuroCup - second-tier European club competition which was a huge success for this small team. Average attendance varied from 500 to 1000 people. Really shameful for such a country where basketball is a second religion as they say it. In that very tournament Lietuvos Siemens arena in the first group stage was something like 1/3 full with its 4000 attendees - in that group Le Mans whose population is more than three times smaller than the one of Vilnius was averaging similar numbers. And Le Mans was eight in France in 2011/2011 while LR is one of the two top teams in Lithuania. Croatian crowds? I understand that Zagreb isn't very popular in Croatia but to have 2,000 attendance in an EL game with season's favourite CSKA - well, it's beyond comprehension. Cibona's games last season were mostly attended by less than 1000 people (I understand that Cibosi are accustomed to playing in EL and losing 0-6 in EC isn't what really titillates them but still...) Cedevita was twice less attended than Spartak SPb playing in the same EC group. So what are these Croatian passionate crowds you're talking about? Turkish crowds? Yes, they are generally numerous ones but these are mostly football fans who come to cheer for their respective club's basketball 'section' so they are very noisy but know very little about bball and its current state of affairs. Yet Galatasaray crowd impressed me last season. As do the team which was the best among the Turkish ones internationally.
So you're clearly chose strange examples of big and passionate crowds as there aren't any of them in some cases and only top clubs has substantial fan base. If we're talking about real passion for basketball and their team and not only among big favourites' fan bases then most obvious examples would be France and Germany where even teams from small towns are very popular among locals - look at Bamberg, a tiny town of some 70,000 people but it has its 6,800 arena constantly sold-out this EL season. Every tenth inhabitant of Bamberg was present at bball games. It's like LR will make 50,000 arena (or in the case of Zalgiris 30,000) full. But you're not lobbying for the more German and French teams in EuroLeague while I think that some of them would definitely be more competitive than Eastern European and Turkish mediocre teams as their respective leagues are stronger and more even.
yes, khimki is loosers in most peoples eays...to me they aor ok, but on other hand you say cedevita is buch of losers on international level??? lol...that's the answer this statment dseserves. cedevita (as cedevita) exists for 6 years, they only played in europe twice. once they were kicked in first round of eurocup and once they finished 3rd overall....lol. once they underperformed, once overperformed and jet they are losers?
only club that was bribed was olypiacos from khimki
3rd....i never mentnioned fans
anway if you wannt to know something about fans here: bbb boycoted cibona for years same as most other fans nomal was boycoting cibona becuse club polcy.....zagreb doesn't have fans at all, and in las 2 years they become hated club in croatia since ciketic started desrtroying that club. even with that they had more fans than khimki. cedevita also don't have fans, but they are trying with marketing and doing good job....but last season cibona finaly started pay atention and almost on all cibona games there was cibona group of fans, and whole finals were sold, last games before end
so here...just a litle bit atetion to fans and here, you can look by yourself...great atmosphere even without bbb who are still boycoting cibona
handball in 90is with bbb
so if you don't know anything abou fans here don't coment something you don't understand
Romeo Travis about Zadar coach Ante NazorRomeo Travis @RomeTrav
I said coach why we practice so much. He said God will bless us after all this hard work. How can I argue with that !
2nd one more thing...something about "passionate croatian fans"....cibona almost went on bankropcy, and even if at that moment cibona was not good with her fans, fans organised actions to help cibona
including moment of silence for cibona during game, action to force city to help cibona
one day when maybe khimki will lose his money and power you and maybe 2 more people will care for khimki, but no matter how in bad relationship cibona is with here fans, no mater how hard times there will always be somebody who wil live for cibona, zadar, split, alkar, sibenik and so on
and next time when you ask where are those "croatian passionate fans" i will just post you clips from damn hocky arenas (in total 2 in croatia) in sport where we suck, but in passion for damn hockey by far over khimki basketball fans
Last edited by pohani komarac; 07-18-2012 at 11:33 PM.
Romeo Travis about Zadar coach Ante NazorRomeo Travis @RomeTrav
I said coach why we practice so much. He said God will bless us after all this hard work. How can I argue with that !
About Croatian hockey: I'm happy that ice hockey is so popular in Croatia (I like that game) but don't get your point. I can upload some videos from bandy games in Russia where on the open air stadiums with temperature like -20C there are some 20,000 people shouting like crazy in the towns like Kemerovo. But what's the relation of all these to basketball fans?
Even if Zagreb and Cedevita has more fans than Khimki (which I strongly doubt) they must be pretty poor or hiding in some shithole for a reason unknown 'cause their European competitions attendances are really shameful for the country with such a great basketball tradition and definitely lesser than really-not-so-great Khimki's ones.
I know about deteriorated relations between Cibona fans and club management but I never was for all those boycotts and so on: you're rooting for your team, for the players, not for the president, administration or something. Yet I can understand them: I was absent for quite a lot games after the firing of Elevich - the man who simply created big basketball in Khimki.
I don't know Cedevita short history well, that's truth, and simply forgot about their FF trip in their first season in EC. My fault. Still, I think you won't argue that Croatian club basketball is in trouble - recently their leading teams complete very solid rosters with good experienced players, both domestic and foreigners, and yet their results are mostly very disappointing.
Talking about audiences I was answering Raskolnikov's thesis that the crowds in 'Lithuania, Croatia and Turkey' are so far superior to the Russian ones and hence the situation when number of the teams from Lithuanian and from Russia in EL are equal is normal despite the huge quality gap between those two leagues. I'm surprised that you're so upset by my remarks. I haven't intended them as a some sort of sentence on the shittiness of Croatian fans. Maybe, you misunderstood me as I really didn't want you to feel offended. But there are some points which I want to clear up in the reference to Khimki fans.
Well, about sensitive 'Khimki has no fans' theme. You know, I feel the need to tell you my personal history as a BC Khimki fan and then you will jump into conclusions. I was playing basketball in my school years in 90s in the Khimki SDUSHOR (sportivnaya detsko-yunosheskaya shkola olimpiyskogo reserva - translated something like children and juniors sporting school of olympic reserve), I stopped it after the first real season of competitions when we have 5 trainings a week and a game in the week-end because it hurt my studies in school. At that time there was no professional basketball in the Khimki at all. Then, a year or two after I stopped to play in the cadet competitions, all of the sudden basketball enthusiast Sergei Elevich convinced some city managers that it would be good to have a team and proposed an ambitious (and highly unrealistic as it seemed in that time) plan to made it one of the better teams in Russia in just 5 to 10 years. I became a fan from the very first days of that team - a dream became reality, my home city has its own basketball team and it's not that bad. I remember BC Khimki playing in the Higher League (2 tier of Russian bball) and me, a high school pupil, screaming my lungs off when we won a promotion to the SuperLeague in the old 'Novator' standing on the balconies which were the only place for the fans (old 'Novator' had no seats whatsoever so all the fans were standing all the game long). It wasn't even a little bit comfortable (in fact it was ugly from the point of comfort) but those experiences invested me with some sense of the brotherhood which I never experienced in the visually beautiful big arenas. And I was with my team from that point onwards - some 15 years, I guess. Their troubles were troubles for me and their wins made my days and sometimes even weeks. Hell, I don't try to be melodramatic but if you think that all BC Khimki fans are those mainstream guys who started to follow basketball after the team from their city became successful both domestically and in Europe then you are very far from truth. There are fans like me who can tell you similar stories and who followed our team all these years, through the good and the bad, through striking wins and painful losses. They have a history of loving European basketball tracing back to their green years: maybe, we aren't that numerous, aren't that loud and mostly don't engage in some kind of fans 'performance' but we're present here and we're rooting for our team with the heart and passion. And you know that's quite a success for Russia where even many youth-level basketball players (not to talk about casual 'basketball fans') are worshiping NBA and NBA only and ain't giving a shit about Euro and international bball - but I think there are many dumbfucks of that kind in almost any European country, just here in Russia they happen to be too numerous and too stupid (maybe it's not exactly their fault 'cause it's a result of a huge propaganda, f.e., the most popular sports sites in Russia write about EL FF in a sentence or two while simultaneously providing countless 'analytic articles' about the most probable candidates for the backup PG in some Golden State Warriors for the next season).
So I think we, Khimki fans, deserve some respect and senseless diatribe 'BC Khimki has no fans' luckily won't be repeated another 1000 times.
I absolutely agree with you...Why three turkish teams,two german and two lithuanians?
Oh,please,Turkey has more teams than Greece and Russia and Germany with Lithuania are in the same level with Greece or Russia?The system is wrong.Turkish teams always eliminated in the Top 16 as lithuanians did.The german teams were eliminated in the regular season.Spain deserves the number of their teams(4),Greece(2),Russia(2) and Italy,but not 3,only 2.
But I think that Procom or Cedevita should participate,because of a big number of countries that represented by teams.
Dude Greece has pao , oly and then only mediocre teams. Adn with more reason in this economical crisis
BARÇA O MUERTE
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